Gloater, I'm very curious about your sources of information on SAI pilots, i.e. the work they do and the pay they get.

I guess your pilot friends are either very junior dropouts of flying college or just not telling the truth. I know for a fact that most pilots never disclose their pay truthfully to their non pilot friend.

Originally posted by mrblitzer21:

ok thanks alot. If you do not plan to renew your contract, is it unlikely that you'll be promoted to Major? In that case career advancement would not be much of an issue would it.

 oh btw pilots have to wake up so early too? lol.

Mr Cheeze is in different time zone, literally.

Originally posted by mrblitzer21:

im just wondering about the options after a career with the air force. cos i dont think i'll want to be stuck with an admin job in the air force, and many have said you'll be doing staff jobs after getting a particular operational status, so maybe its better to join sia. So even chopper pilots can transition fairly easily?

Btw, some here mentioned a 10 yr contract, some mentioned a 12yr contract, so is it 10 or 12? From the time you get your wings right?

thanks

Some of the guys posting here seem to think that staff job is admin job. But staff job is not admin job. As a staff officer, in most cases, you will be involved in planning of operations at RSAF level. It can be as simple as justifying which squadron to be deployed for foreign detachment or as interesting as proposing what new aeroplane to buy. Performance in staff tour may even decide if yo are good enough to become general.

Anyway, all these are so far down the road. If military flying is for you, just go for it. It is hard enough to decide what to eat for my next meal, what more to think of what's happening to me in 10 years time.

Also, I don't think there's anymore contract service for officers, it has become something called SAVER. The 10 or 12 year thing is your bond, i.e. you are obligated to serve the time after completion of flying training. Suggest you find out more from the recruitment centre before scribbling on the dotted line.

If you are medically fit, there's no need to worry too much. Besides, somethings are pre-destined, e.g. arm length, torso length, heart condition, etc.

Given the stringent requirement just to be selected for pilot training, it is no surprise that many do not make it. After the initial selection, it is a long road ahead... you'll be labelled "trainee" for at least 2 years... Also, things will only get tougher downstream, but I hope you will not be intimidated. Wish you all the best.

What I meant was the total pay over the course of career, i.e. till 45 in RSAF and till 62 in SIA. But like I said, it's gut feel and not substantiated with figures. Pay as pilot in both RSAF and SIA are definitely more than 4K. Then again, it's not just about pay. There's opportunty cost involved. Good example is the wait till 26 for SIA.

About the pay. My gut feel is that pay in RSAF and SIA is about the same if you work till retirement age. Of course the difference is that in RSAF, you retire at 45, while in SIA, you can fly till 62 (need to verify this but I think it's around this figure) provided you are medically fit. If you ask me, I think it's half truth that pay is better in SIA.

If you make it in RSAF, you will be collecting a decent pay when you graduate at the age of about 22-23. What do you think your counterparts will be doing at this age?Some years down the road, when you feel like a career switch, the SIA option is still open. No one can fault you then for jumping ship because it is your right to the livelihood of your choice. If you don't make it as RSAF pilot, you just ORD like normal NS and start thinking about SIA option in a couple years time.

As for SIA, you can only join to be pilot after 26. By the time you qualify as co-pilot, you will be close to 30. Meanwhile what do you do? Study? Work? Do you want to spend your next few years risking not being accepted by SIA? If you are fortunate, you may establish a different career before 26 and forgo the idea of commercial flying altogether. If you are unlucky, you may find that the years before had gone wasted with nothing achieved and your dream as "big buck earning" SIA pilot go burst.

You can hear all the good and bad things about SIA and RSAF, but entry into SIA is just as no guarantee as the RSAF.

Cheeze, good to see you.

I think we need bust some of the myths running around here before Yamato thinks that the RSAF all crap...though it may be true sometimes. I'll start...

Pilots do not live near air bases, some may but not all. Who wants to subject themselves to the noise of aircraft taking off at full power? Just ask people who live around Seng Kang and Punggol.

To be recalled and be ready to take off in 15 min... no way! ... walking from the main gate of any airbase to the squadron already take up more than 15 min. BTW, SIA pilots are also required to be on standby.

It is unlikely that you will log more flying hour in simulator than actual flying in the RSAF unless you screw up so badly that extra training is required. On the other hand, some SIA pilots need to hop into a simulator to refresh their take-off and landing to be legal to fly because they have no opportunity to do so in real flight.

Originally posted by KiraYamato100:

No problem with me ^_^

RSAF Pilot = Pilot + Officer

Fully aware that as a RSAF pilot, one would have to mind about not only flying but also responsibilities as an officer.

Or else, why would pilots have their ranks as officers at the lowest and through OCS first...?

Good for you then. Be warned that you may end up with heli or transport instead depending on ur attributes. But these 2 platforms are just as demanding as fighters. PM me if you want to know more.

I think what's important for the TS is to calibrate his expectations on being a pilot in the RSAF.

First and foremost, he will be an officer. Being an officer, he is expected to pick up paperwork, projects and what have you. It is the same with any vocations in the army, navy or air force. Almost every SAF officer will serve some time on staff job and this is part of requirement for advancement. However, in the initial few years as a pilot in the air force, you'll find that most of the time is spent on building up his operational capabilities. After achieving certain level of ops status, he will then be expected to take up secondary duties like officers in any other vocation/service. Do you think a regular artillery officer only fire shells everyday?

Therefore, being a RSAF pilot is about being both a combatant and an officer. So, if the TS just want to fly fighter and overlook his duties as an officer, then this job is not for him.

Originally posted by stellazio:

its funny how some people think they know more bout the airforce and pilots just because they went to an open house..

i'm laughing my ass off..

I think I've been around long enough to differentiate between fact and fiction.

Anyway, flying in the RSAF is not about "flying around the island". How do you think the RSAF conduct bilateral exercises with foreign air forces that deploy here?

Also, being on standby is part and parcel of any military force and therefore it is something you are expected to do if you join the air force. What good is an air force if every pilot wants to have every weekend and public holiday off? In any case, try asking around any SIA pilots, you will find that only the lucky few will get to spend their X'mas, New Year, Chinese New Year and etc in S'pore.

Pay wise, I think a newly qualified RSAF pilot's pay is comparable to a newly qualified SIA pilot. The main difference is that the mentioned RSAF pilot is probably 22-23 years old whereas the SIA pilot is about 29 years old at best. To earn big bucks as captain in SIA, you'll have to wait till you are in your late 30's.

I read with amazement some of the stuff posted here. For a start, while simulator flying is part of the air force training, there is a lot more actual flying than in simulators. Also, if you had been to the Air Force open house recently, you'll probably find that some pilots are of LTA rank and they do fly real aircraft regularly.  On the other hand, in SIA, if you are in the wrong aircraft fleet, you may find yourself visiting the simulator regularly to keep current with take-offs and landings.

Will post a bit more when more come to mind.

Don’t let your imagination run wild. Aircraft with engine problem, especially single engine ones, will not be over flying populace to land on a runway.

The acquisition of new fighter is likely to be based on what new capabilities that the RSAF want to get their hands on. The air force should have a whole spectrum of operational roles to be filled whether for peacetime or contingencies, for the present and the future. As the F5 approaches its end of life, RSAF will need to reassign fighters to fill the roles vacated by the F5, could be F16 or F15 or both or other fighters. At the same time we need to ponder on what new capabilities/technology are out there for us to employ on future platforms.

As such, it will not be a clear cut direct replacement of the F5.

IMO, it’s quite unlikely that the F-5, or any other fighter, can sneak in so close to its opponent without being detected. Also, I think trying to achieve gun kill on the first pass is really ambitious.

Given that most fighters around us have more superior performance envelope, the F-5 is quite screwed if he needs to do close combat. Makes no difference what gunsight he has if he can’t manoeuvre to opponent’s six.

Thanks, Pitot.
Those living around Sengkang and Punggol area would probably notice that the aircraft from PLAB always take off in the northerly direction and then make an immediate turn to the south.

Originally posted by Moonstriker:

the 1st pic regarding the take-off route along runway 20 on heading 200 is to prevent possible conflict with Changi airport's civil aircraft traffic. If aircraft were to take off on heading 023, they will have to turn east and cross changi aerodrome and cutting through the approach and departure glidepaths of civil aircraft in changi before heading out to join the air routes.
military flights causes alot of problems for our civil aviation air traffic control...

Noise abatement wise, well... i don't see how taking off towards aljunied n kallang area can reduce noise disturbance to ppl living there. taking off on runway 20 @ PLAB, it would head off to minimal residential areas and thus, engine noise won't affect almost anyone...

The first picture actually shows the take off on runway 02... not 20.

Originally posted by Lance_han:

y's tat???

A lot of problems from its the early development was publicised, especially the crash during demo flight in front of Taiwan's then President.

My Taiwanese friends called it I-Don't-Fly

Indonesia probably using this to entice US to lift the embargo before the defence money goes to China.

Originally posted by kaka_22:

Hmmm a little off-topic : Indo Pesident SBY is a 4 star Genaral rite?thats wat i heard.....

Incidentally, SBY graduated from the same officer class as the current Air Force and Navy chiefs. hmmm...

Got a Chinese friend in RSAF who married a Muslim and also converted to Muslim. Go for it if you love her!

Originally posted by Gordonator:

lastly, it'll be best that your rifle has a very bright front side tip that glows clearly in the dark.

If I recall correctly, after you adjust the foresight tip for zeroing, the luminous tip needs to be turned so that it faces you, else you will never see it in the dark.
Then again, if the M16 is no longer in use, it won't make a difference.

Originally posted by freddy the K:

my dear, "u obviously haven't paid much attention to the bigwigs talking have u?" I'm one of the few BIGWIGs who give talks to JCs on a regular basis and i speak from experience. How many talks have u attended in NJC? 1,2,3 or 4? do u even know who is the military head u posed the qn to? no? well, i guess anyone can say "oh, I spoke to a big shot and he couldn't give me an ans". So what is it that "they were saying they could do this and that"?

Originally posted by freddy the K:

look, heng, i dun have all nite to wait for you to post a rebuttal. i'm all shacked out from OFE and need to catch some zzzzs

Some big-wigged clown you are to blurt out operational code words in your posts. Don't know what sort of big shot you are in SAF. But to flame someone in your first post of this thread just shows how much of an officer you are (if you are one). You are acting like you are a nobody in the SAF looking for attention.

Freddy, I sense arrogance and loss of composure in you. If you are truely some big wig from SAF giving talks in schools, god help SAF.